100 billion in exchange for a question! Ma Yun, are you OK? If you don't understand technology, you have to build a research institute that changes the world.

This article was first published on WeChat public account: Shanghai Securities News. The content of the article belongs to the author's personal opinion and does not represent the position of Hexun.com. Investors should act accordingly, at their own risk.

SSE reporter Wen Ting


Shangzheng reporter Wen Ting

The day before the opening of the 2017 Yunqi Conference, Alibaba's market value exceeded 470 billion US dollars, once surpassed Amazon. All the great gods are expecting Ma Yun to throw out "eggs" at the Yunqi Conference, inciting the capital market, but the result is the plan to establish the "Dharma Institute" of the Institute.

Dharma House is questioned

Ma Yun, who knows the least about technology, wants to build a research institute that changes the world, and it still has to be 100 billion! Some people are applauding and some are watching movies. For Ali, this is probably the best breakthrough for iterating in the next five years.

The Shaolin Temple in Dharma Temple is the place where the Dharma ancestors practiced meditation and practiced martial arts. It is the achievement of "Yi Jin Jing" and "Jian Jing Jing". In addition to Shaolin Kungfu, it is also highly respected by Zen Buddhism. Ali's "Dharma House" is questioned because its appetite for technology is a bit big.

The first research areas published by Dharma Institute include: quantum computing, machine learning, basic algorithms, network security, visual computing, natural language processing, next-generation human-computer interaction, chip technology, sensor technology, embedded systems, etc. Machine intelligence, intelligent networking, financial technology and other industrial fields. It seems that every single thing is enough to make a career.

Then the voice of doubt came - Ali is like a full bow, although the stock price is high, but the stamina is worrying, and now there is no border in technology research and development. Some people say that they are already waiting for the Dharma Institute to end. More self-speaking language is not surprisingly endless, and in the title it is asserted that "Alibaba's Dharma House must be a farce."


Then the voice of doubt came - Ali is like a full bow, although the stock price is high, but the stamina is worrying, and now there is no border in technology research and development. Some people say that they are already waiting for the Dharma Institute to end. More self-speaking language is not surprisingly endless, and in the title it is asserted that "Alibaba's Dharma House must be a farce."

This absolute argument is not scientific in itself, but it is a review of a newly established research center. Is it a little condolence?

Ma Yun is just coming to set up the stage.

First of all, Dharma is not a cost center, and there will be KPIs in the future. "Developing without sending" is not what Dharma wants. "Alibaba does not expect to make money on it, but it has to make money itself. Of course, earning money depends on solving problems, and we have problems that need to be solved." This is Ma Yun. The original words of the Institute's positioning, in the end, Ma Yun, a teacher, was first a businessman.

Then, how do the research and development of many black technology in Dharma Institute “make money”? Please note that Dharma is not alone in the fight, Ali Cloud will be an important output port. Ali has many pieces of ants, clouds and rookies in the ecological matrix. Among them, Alibaba Cloud has supported the R&D responsibilities of many of the Group's cutting-edge technologies with its technical orientation. The positioning of Dharma Institute is clearer, and it is in line with Alibaba Cloud's advanced and medium-term technology.

Alibaba Cloud President Hu Xiaoming explained that Dharma will focus on the future technology of the foundation layer, and Alibaba Cloud is a technology-driven commercial company, paying more attention to the medium-term technological breakthrough. In addition to the technical level of interaction between the two parties, the business model of Dharma Institute itself will be closely cooperated with Alibaba Cloud. All products will be commercialized through the platform of Alibaba Cloud. This is able to solve the problem. A good model for balancing short-term and long-term, investment and business.

The new Dharma Dean, Ali CTO Zhang Jianfeng further added that cutting-edge technology research and development is inseparable from industrial support, and the Ali business scene and customers connected to the Alibaba Cloud platform can provide a good scene for cutting-edge technology research and development, and even Commercial platform, this is the biggest value of Dharma now.


The new Dharma Dean, Ali CTO Zhang Jianfeng further added that cutting-edge technology research and development is inseparable from industrial support, and the Ali business scene and customers connected to the Alibaba Cloud platform can provide a good scene for cutting-edge technology research and development, and even Commercial platform, this is the biggest value of Dharma now.

3 years, 100 billion,

What is the "Dharma House"?

Talent! Think about it from another angle. Is Shaolin Temple not so powerful? The bronze man has to make up 18, and there is still a sweeping moment at the crucial moment. In his speech, Ma Yun also mentioned talents several times in key sessions, including the first day of the Yunqi Conference with 13 first-line scientists, and has established the Chinese Academy of Sciences - Alibaba Quantum Computing Laboratory, Tsinghua University - Ant Financial Digital Finance Technology Joint Lab, Zhejiang University - Alibaba Frontier Technology Joint Research Center, etc.

100 billion in exchange for a question! Ma Yun, are you OK? If you don't understand technology, you have to build a research institute that changes the world.


To put it bluntly, Dharma Institute has built a "group" for all front-line scientific and technological talents. Who do you ask the owner?

Ma Yun said: "I hope that the leadership of this laboratory must have a strong Business sense. Our CTO Zhang Jianfeng has a strong Business Sense, he has rotated many departments, pure technology, he is useless, pure business It’s useless to fool him. A scientist must have the consciousness of an entrepreneur, and an entrepreneur must have the rigorous attitude of a scientist, because only then can there be a future.”

At present, “Dharma Institute” has begun to set up cutting-edge science and technology research centers around the world, including Asian Dharma Institute, American Dharma Institute, European Dharma Institute, and in Beijing, Hangzhou, Singapore, Israel, San Mateo, Bell. Laboratories with different research directions have been set up in Victoria and Moscow, and 100 top scientists and researchers are planned to be introduced.


At present, “Dharma Institute” has begun to set up cutting-edge science and technology research centers around the world, including Asian Dharma Institute, American Dharma Institute, European Dharma Institute, and in Beijing, Hangzhou, Singapore, Israel, San Mateo, Bell. Laboratories with different research directions have been set up in Victoria and Moscow, and 100 top scientists and researchers are planned to be introduced.

The starting point of Alibaba's R&D technology

What social problems can be solved?

Ma Yun

When the company was founded seven or eight years ago, I firmly opposed the company's research labs and laboratories. No one in the past ten years can talk to me about the lab. I can't talk to me about the Microsoft R&D department and the IBM R&D department. I don't think these R&D departments will go well.

Because we were a startup at the time. Although we emphasize technology, it is a catastrophe for companies to consider R&D before they have a foothold. I found that the vast majority of companies are researching and not developing, that is, Research for fun, it is impossible to go for a long time; Re-search for profit, it is even more impossible. At that time, I went to a large foreign company. The engineer told me how to make money on this product, instead of telling me what problems the customer would solve. I think this problem is big.

Earlier I knew that Alibaba didn't have Ready yet. I just wanted to solve many problems through technology, instead of upgrading to the lab. And Microsoft, Bell or IBM, these industrial-era lab-based models made great contributions at the time, but in fact they have shrunk in the past decade, it is not the future. What is the future of the laboratory, you must not act rashly until you understand it and your company has not established a firm foothold.

Alibaba's profit at that time was very low, and this money might not be done once. But today Ali is 18 years old, we have to be responsible; today's Ali is not the same as before. Everyone knows that Ali is an e-commerce. In fact, e-commerce is only 20% of Alibaba. We are famous for e-commerce. E-commerce is the entry point, but in essence we are not an e-commerce company. We have positioned ourselves as a data-driven company nine years ago. In the past nine years, Alibaba has become one of the few companies that can handle rich data sources.

Today, Alibaba is the world's largest e-commerce company in terms of scale effect. In fact, Amazon, eBay, and the latter five all add up, not Alibaba. To do this, behind the strong technical support of Alibaba. On the light of a double 11, the technical content is high, and more than many people imagine.

Therefore, I am very grateful to Alibaba for having a group of engineers who have gone on to work hard. I don't know technology, but because I don't know technology, I support technology more than anyone else. I always feel that something I don't understand is going to happen. On the contrary, in BAT, Tencent or Baidu are engineers. Their judgment is based on the fact that the technology can be completed; my judgment is based on this matter and will not die tomorrow. If we don’t do this, we will be unlucky tomorrow, and our company will not cross tomorrow, even if it If you can't do it, you have to find a way to do it. Because of this, Alibaba entered the cloud computing nine years ago.

We judge by solving problems, not by taking the initiative to solve the future, and not to solve the future with yesterday's ideas. This is a different place for Alibaba and other companies.

Alibaba's technical research and development

Is to create a future for the country and society

Alibaba is not an ordinary commercial company. We have a huge responsibility in this country and in this era. Ten years ago, I said in Alibaba: China's e-commerce has developed well and has nothing to do with Alibaba; however, China's e-commerce has not developed well and has a relationship with Alibaba. Because 90% of Chinese e-commerce talents were in our company at that time, we did not do it right, which means that this country is not doing right.

Thinking to the end, I think Alibaba must be a company that creates the future.


Thinking to the end, I think Alibaba must be a company that creates the future.

We must be an innovative company, we want to be the engine of national innovation, not our own innovation; we must be a company of the era, The company of the century; we must be a global company, we must represent this era Young people. I have never changed this view for ten years. You only have to think like this, the company's intention will be different from other companies on the first day.

Some people have challenged what Alibaba has to do, and you are everywhere. But I think Alibaba itself should not be just an e-commerce company, but an engine of innovation in the country and society and the world. Just as electricity has no boundaries, you can't say that industry can use electricity, agriculture can't use electricity, and all walks of life must use Internet technology and ideas to influence and change. Alibaba must take up this responsibility.

The establishment of "Dharma House" is to support

The fifth largest economy, serving the world economy

Because of this thinking, and because of our appreciation and respect for technology, Alibaba is probably the best company to cross the border, the best combination of business and technology.

To this day, making money is not difficult for Alibaba. In the past 18 years, I have considered and convened a meeting for more than three hours about discussing making money. I think the things in front are right, the money is naturally more; things are not done right, the money will eventually go. Alibaba now has money, we must consider the future. Alibaba has positioned itself as a company that creates the future and must think about the future.

What is our laboratory positioning? I think it should not be Research for fun, nor Research for profit, but Re-search for solving the problem with profit and fun. ). Companies in the 21st century can only survive if they solve social problems. If they do not solve problems, they will not survive.

For fun went too far, for profit to go too close, not long. How big a company is doing is how big the social problem is solved by the enterprise. The greater the social problem solved, the greater the responsibility and the more benefits. This is the logic of Alibaba's thinking.

Today, Alibaba's scale is already equal to the world's twenty-first largest economy. We have more than 500 million monthly active users, huge data, countless consumers, and the daily troubles far exceed everyone's imagination. But these troubles are opportunities for scientists. I came up a decade ago. Alibaba lacks engineers, but sociologists, economists, psychologists, and computer experts. We are nurturing a society, not a company.

Alibaba's goal for the next 20 years is to build the world's fifth largest economy. It is not that we are arrogant, but that the world needs such an economy, and there must be such an economy. Today's Alibaba is rich, resourceful, talented, influential, and has the world's largest database of data. These resources, talents, and data should not be used only by Ali. They should be used by the world and used for the future. This is our true thought.

We have to establish this economy to accomplish three goals, the first goal is to make the world economy more Inclusive, the second to make the world economy more sustainable, and the third to make the world economy more happy and healthy. Achieving these three goals will solve 100 million jobs for the world, serve 2 billion people across borders, and create a profitable platform for 10 million companies.

Such a fifth-largest economy needs technical support, and there are too many technical problems to deal with, so this lab is built for the economy of the next two decades. The economy is not an Alibaba economy, nor is the laboratory a laboratory belonging to Alibaba. I don't want to turn it into Alibaba's lab. It's hard for Alibaba's engineers to solve their own problems, but the problem is not too big.

"Dharma House" will live longer than Alibaba

I hope that Alibaba has three things that can be passed down. I personally hope that the first is that Alibaba left this laboratory, it lives better than Alibaba; the second leaves a lakeside university, trains entrepreneurs, tells all their gains and losses; another one, Alibaba The charity foundation has lived very long. One day Alibaba is gone, these three are the best things we have left for the world.

But if you live long, you may not live well. If the candle is to burn brightly, it must burn very quickly; if you burn for a long time, it must be not so bright. I went straight to tell Wang Jian (Chairman of the Alibaba Technical Committee) that this lab must not wait for funds. This money is for you to be a venture capital fund. This lab is to make money. If you have the awareness of earning money, you can live. If you have money, you will live if you have money. If you have money, you will die. What I want is that the company is dead and the laboratory is still alive. This is a good model to find out. I hope that not only will the paper survive, but more than 90% of the research will not only be in the laboratory, but also in the market. Only in this way can the laboratory go long.

In the establishment of the laboratory, I have considered it for a long time, so it was delayed. Real scientists and real entrepreneurs are common. First, we are all optimists. We believe because we believe that most people believe because they saw it. If you don't believe that this will happen, it is impossible to Re-search for fun; second, we have the spirit, we dare to take risks; the third must have innovation, creativity, creativity, and must take a different path. When I do something in Alibaba, I will ask: Do you have any way to do something different from others? If you do exactly the same, why do you do it?

Two weeks ago I received a call from Tong Wenhong (Chief Manpower Officer of Alibaba Group) to discuss the name of the laboratory. I said why we must say the research institutes and laboratories. Why can't we create a name for ourselves? I think Dharma is very good. She said what Dharma meant, how to translate in English, I said it was called Damo, and called and shunned. Google was very strange at first, and it was slowly called out; Intel didn’t know what it meant until now, and he was used to it when he called. It is called the name of Dharma, and it is better to call it, raise it, love it, and love it more and more.

Eighteen years have passed, and we have decided to set up this laboratory. Many people say what is your future, whether to learn Microsoft's model or Bell Labs' model. This question has been discussed. A company of the last century, once seized an opportunity or two opportunities, will become a great company. But in the 21st century, to become a great company, we must solve the terrible problem. To become a great enterprise, we must solve the great problem.

Therefore, Alibaba hopes to get out of its own model. We will learn IBM, learn Microsoft, learn Bell Labs, and learn the tremendous experience and lessons learned in the development of human history and technology in the past, but we must go our own way. Many of us in China think about filling the gaps in the world. The United States used to have one. We must have one. Before the Soviet Union, we must have one. Why? Why can't Chinese people go out of their own set? With China's resources today, China's responsibility, talents, and capital, we can completely develop our own path in the field of science and technology and build our own first-class. We must think that Dharma must and must surpass Intel. We must go beyond Microsoft and must surpass IBM. Because we were born in the 21st century, we have the opportunity to gain an advantage.

Looking at the development of social economy in the past, look at the power index. In the future, we will look at the calculation index. In the past, we were electrified, whether it was a channel or not. In the future, we should look at whether or not to access data and see the ability of Internet coverage. I think that in the next 30 years, all walks of life will undergo tremendous changes. In the future, it will not belong to Internet companies. In the future, it will be the best company to make good use of Internet companies.

There are more and more people worried about the future. They are worried that technology will replace human beings, technology will eliminate employment, and technology will widen the gap between wealth and wealth. I believe that this is all empty worry, because technology and technology must exist for people. The fear of technology is due to lack of self-confidence and lack of imagination for the future. Any technological revolution does have an impact on traditional industries, traditional technologies, and traditional employment, but any technological revolution has brought new jobs.

The IT era is making itself stronger and stronger, and DT technology is making people more and more powerful and making the world more and more shared. So the IT era is 28 theory, and the DT era is 82 theory. The DT era must emphasize Pratt & Whitney, must emphasize sustainable development, DT era must pay attention to individuality, because only personalization, it is possible to have Happy & Healthy, to have real happiness, e-commerce will become a real E-Business In the future, SMEs will be multinational companies. In the future, there will be no Chinese manufacturing or American manufacturing, only Made IN Internet. What Dharma has to do is to really make the technology universal. If you can't make the technology more popular, let more people share and enjoy the dividend of technology, I believe that the first is definitely not going to be long, and the second will be overthrown after a long time.

I hope that the leadership of this lab must have a strong Business sense. Our CTO (Zhang Jianfeng) has a strong Business Sense. He has rotated a lot of departments, and he is useless by pure technology. He is useless for pure business. A scientist must have the consciousness of an entrepreneur. An entrepreneur must have the rigorous attitude of a scientist, because only then can there be a future.

In five years, we will invest more than 100 billion in the Dharma Institute. Alibaba does not expect to make money on it, but it has to make money itself. Of course, earning money depends on solving problems, and we have problems that need to be solved. This is my thinking about the positioning of the institute.

Based on these thoughts, I am full of confidence in our Dharma court. Not only because we have to invest 100 billion, not only because we have resources, but also because we have too many problems to solve and to cross.

(This article is a talk between Ma Yun and scientists and a speech at Yunqi Conference)

Production: He Yongxin Picture Editor: Comparison


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